Live Feed Discussion-August 20

[sdkgeo]

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[sdkgeo]

Morning all. Happy eviction day!

[KeninVA]

Morning geo, and all who follow,

The end of a strange week. Becky will walk out the door without campaigning. Austin scumbaggery towards Vanessa in full swing, and James/Meg, despite TTOTambz2 best pleas, really are done with the game, and want to spend the rest of the time in summer camp.

Becky going home tonight, despite being injured, and on vicodin, seeming to make Jmac the ideal boot this week. I understand why Vaustwins would not consider it, and why Steve would not consider it, but James/Meg ready to boot her, with Jmac as a direct threat to them, seems ludicrous. Vanessa brought it up, Austwins shot it down, and the idea died.

Vanessa, at this point, should definitely realize something is up. She has no confidant to talk to, so we don't know what she is thinking, but she has to realize something is wrong when

A. . Her "allies" won't consider booting Jmac, in order to keep a weak competitor who is unlikely to win the expected endurance comp coming Thursday.
B. Austin keeps telling her to throw the HoH, when her winning would keep her "side" in control of the game. From a strategy standpoint it does not make any sense.

James/Meg basically tell each other, they are tired of Becky talking, bored with "the game" i.e. scheming, and just want to get to F5 with their friends, that cute couple with the twin sister. Then they can all fight it out. Austin read James/Meg perfectly, and they are now his loyal puppets, ready to attack anyone after them, and then compete at F5 down in a series of competitions that they are not good at (puzzles, house dates, logic). Their discussion makes it abundantly clear, it's not the money, it's the fun they are after.

Jmac, if he is HoH, currently plans to nominate Vanessa and either Steve or Liz. I wonder if Steve goes along with it, or if he pushes Jmac to sell the idea to Liz. I suspect, Liz is not going to be to happy. The fall out from that might generate a little drama, that is totally missing from the game at the moment. Vaustwins vs Jmac, is kind of boring right now, as Jmac's current plans are 3 boots away from going after them (i.e. the same F5 as Meg and James want). I said before, this seems like a very high risk strategy, and his dislike of Vanessa is driving a lot of this, which, does not seem like a good game move to me.

Trying for HoH, Jmac/Vanessa/James/Meg. Maybe with luck, the HoH comp is the 3 returnee's in a swap out move. That would ratchet up the drama, and if Liz were to fall early, I suspect Austin would be fighting to get put out at that point.

Nothing much to see today, unless your tastes run to softcore porn, with a creepy circus clown as one of the stars.

[BettyBoo]

I actually got nauseated watching them smooch on last night's show. Had to close my eyes from the horror.

[Ellee1]

Lol @ softcore porn with a creepy circus clown.

[Luanne]

Good morning all- I have to admit I have not been watching the feeds. For some reason, I do not enjoy watching them so I find better things to do with my time.

This has been a good year for BB. The problem is that there are only a couple of players that know the game and that are really trying to win. Several are just happy to be that and just want to have fun.

I hope James really wants to win the game and takes his sunglasses off. If he wants to win, he can not be in the F4 with Austin, Liz and Julia. I think he is trying to get closer to Julia with all the pranks. In a F4 with those three, unless it is endurance, he does not have a chance. Wake up James, work to take out one of the threesome and not Vanessa.

I really liked Johnny and thought he was a master player just waiting to make his move. The week he cried when Clay went on the block floored me. If he was really playing the game, it would not have mattered to him. Clay/Shelli put him on the block, asked him to throw POV and then asked him not to use the POV. That should have sent him running from them, it just brought him closer. His personal feelings for Vanessa is not good game playing. He appears to be with Steve but does not listen to his thoughts. I do not think he is a good player.

I love Meg but she is just there to earn a little money, get exposure and have a little fun.

Steve, in my opinion, is playing the best game right now. No one is talking about taking him out. He is not running to James and Meg with information, so he is not playing the rat. He is just staying friendly to them. Looking at Steve from James's and Meg's eyes, he is just Steve being Steve. If he makes it to F2, will he be able to sell his game to the jury.

Vanessa, Vanessa- she knows something is off. She really does have a good read on people. She knows that Steve and the threesome have changed. It does her no good to try and continue to talk game to them. She can not run to James and Meg because she knows they will share that information. James has to go to her. She just does not know when to stop the game and have fun.

Unless something changes with this weeks HOH, I see at least two of the threesome in the F2. Julia needs to step up her game since Liz told her that she would take Austin. Austin would take Julia. Julia would take Liz. If Liz is in the F2, I look for her to win.

Gosh, I sure did not mean to have such a long post. Please forgive me. It will not happen again, just catching up on my thoughts. I love this game of BB. Have a great day.

[KeninVA]

Luanne, I don't think there are any master players this season. Every single player has pretty deep flaws. Vanessa lacks both a social game, and an appreciation of it's power (my big hint, she thought Derrick won by luck last year. She did not understand that Cody lost sight of his own self interest. And that is what she plays on. People need to all know their self-interest, and be rational, in order to motivate their actions in the game.).

John is actually not totally in control of his emotions either. He has been chasing Vanessa down since week 3, working very diligently to cut Clay and Shelli away from her, and now working to continue to target her, and pursue a high risk strategy, rather then team with her. She has become his Moby Dick, and it could easily cost him his run in the game. And, anyone who banks on winning out to the end, in a 3 on 2 matchup, where both of the two can compete in F5 HoH, is not a good strategist. If he wins, great, but it will be by luck, not strategy that got him there.

I have no words for James/Meg other than summer camp kids. They got week reprieve, could have actually been able to pull Vanessa for this vote, this week, giving them a shot at being 4 strong at the end of next week, if Jackie came back, which would have re-flipped the house.

Austin and the twins are playing emotionally, and while Austin maybe has the best social game in the house, even Liz woke up to the fact that if Vanessa wins HoH, all the rats working for them, are going to run to her. And if Vanessa wants to be vindictive, at the cost of her game, their game could come to an end too. Not very well played.

We are really entering a no strategy zone, (except Jmac and Steve, which for me is hard to watch because their conversations tend to be infrequent, they don't actually air all the issues, and both operate with incomplete information.). The rest, once Vanessa gets put out, are just in summer camp.

[DeeAnneG]

To the wonderful analysts out there: Is there any way that the returning HG teams up with ?? and knocks the Triplets of their pedestal?

[KeninVA]

Jackie, would definitely team up with James and Meg, and if Vanessa has been evicted prior, a Jackie HoH would for sure be the Twins or Austin/Liz on the block, I think. If Vanessa is in the game, I think they are all programmed to go after her. Shelli, I think, teams with Steve/Jmac, and if Vanessa is in the game, she seems programmed to go after her. If Vanessa is out, not sure if she targets Austin or the James next.

Becky, if she does not win HoH, is likely to just go after Vanessa again, and then target Austwins.

So, if the goal is to get a quick strike at the Vaustwins, you should be hoping for Jmac HoH, Vanessa/Steve to lose PoV (some risk Steve would use it, even if small), and then Vanessa boot, followed by Jackie coming in and winning HoH.

[Tjeffy]

I think that if they return today the chances are greater. All 3 evicted will view Vanessa as no.1 boot. But Vanessa has so much info on the Austwins that she eventually tells some. If Vanessa talks then she can switch the target to them. I do think if James wins HOH there is a better chance she tells him before JMac. If the evicted doesn't return til next week and Vanessa is the boot she will still tell some info if she feels that the Austwins have anything to do with her eviction. I can see that James if told info directed at him he could switch his target as he did with Clelli and Becky. JMO

[TTOTambz2]

Ken, Don't discount how pissed JMac will be when he learns Steve has been aligned with Austin & Vanessa pretty much since the start of week 2, in multiple alliances and NEVER shared any of those details with him.

[nonobadfish]

Morning geo, Ken, Luanne, dee, and everyone...

Looking forward to the endurance comp tonight....Go JMac! TTO, I saw your post from last night where you asked my thoughts. Two things in response:

1. I don't think JMac is in ANY true 'ride or die', not even with Becky. I think he likes Becky, and he likes Steve, and he prefers playing with them over others, but if he wakes up in the morning and one of them is gone, he will just reset and move on. And he's not opposed to losing either of them when it gets to the point that they don't help his game. (He did cry over Clay, but he had been drinking while watching that comp, so I think those tears were a combination of alcohol, homesickness, and frustration that the game is not what he expected. He doesn't seem to be having fun).
I really do see him as a loner in the game who doesn't want to plan too far ahead. And he does do what he tells us he is going to do (throw the comp, etc) because at THAT MOMENT it seems to him that it's the best thing for his game on that day (even if I'm screaming, "Don't do it, JMac!"). This is how he plays: He'll see if he's still in the game after the eviction. He'll make a decision to try to win HoH or not based on what he feels today and also who is still in the comp. Then he'll see who wins and make a new plan. As I said yesterday, it's a scary way to play. The one thing he never waivers from though: He wants Vanessa out.

2. I'd be very surprised if JMac gave James the HoH if it comes down to the two of them. I read your reasons why this would work, but I'm not sure that he trusts James enough to jump off and let James have it, even if James made a deal. James has been known to not keep the deal made at the end of endurance. If I had to guess, I think JMac wants to win tonight. But he's fooled me before.


DeeAnneG....I'm by no means an analyst, but I think if Vanessa goes home next week, then Shelli would definitely team up with JMac and Steve....and she's after Austin. So that could happen. Becky might go after the Austwins, depending on what happens while she's gone. Jackie is a wild card for me...she's smart enough to see she needs to get them (especially after they compare notes in the jury house), but she may be still angry at Steve. And I think if they vote Vanessa out and she returns, she would target Austwins. So there is hope....but mainly if Vanessa as the target is already gone.

[nonobadfish]

I wish they would bring the Returning Juror back tonight because I think the person coming back in will help stop some of the summer camp mentality. I said last night that I think JMac and Vanessa are the only two totally focused on game. Steve is a close third, but he's lost focus a bit because he's so happy to be one of the cool kids.

Ken, I'm glad that Jackie isn't angry at Steve (I didn't read any of her interviews, so I was worried). And I agree, Austwins should keep Vanessa. But I don't want them to because I don't want them to have a shield to hide behind. Those twins really may be the worst BB game players I've ever watched.

[KeninVA]

Nono, I feel you. I am torn between wanting Vanessa to go farther, and wanting the three headed monster in jury, where I don't have off the feeds, because my choices are the softcore porn in HoH, and some combination of houseguests sleeping until the next competition. My revelation today was this is how S14 would have looked, once Frank got out, if Dan had not been scheming and plotting every week to get Ian out of the house. Almost all the parallels are their. jen city/Joe for james/Meg, Austin/Liz for Danielle/Shane (Danielle forcing herself on a reluctant Shane, Austin forcing himself on a reluctant Liz), Jmac for Dan, Steve for Ian. The only difference right now is Van, and she is in win one of two comps next week or go home territory. But at least if she is out, Vaustwins wake up to a new world order, where they are now target one for everyone.

[TTOTambz2]

Ken.... Jenn City & Joe for Meg & James?????? Umm when were either of Jenn City or Joe as social as the Goblins & did either of them win any HOH's? I can't believe you think so little of James who has won 2 HOH's and might win his 3rd tonight! I'm not sure if I should be sad or mad. LOL

[herms is here]

If Liz does end up at the end, you will have together props. But in a strange game of people throwing comps I would say that it was in part given to her. I would love a season where the houseguests did not throw competitions.

Keninva, IMO you always have a good read on the house, do you think that a Jackie return is best for James/Meg game? Would it put them back into game mode. Also, I know this may be delusional on my part, but could James and Vanessa be covert team ( they are secretly together, that is why she hasn't made any deals with him).

Riding the season out to see how Liz gets to the F2.

[KeninVA]

I think if Jackie comes back in, she slaps them silly and wakes them up. I hope jury house was boring, and they wake up to being in a game for life changing money.

James is lost, I think. There is no chance he and Vanessa are in a secret deal, and Vanessa is very careful with James, since she knows he has rat tendencies. She is not going to expose herself to him.

[nonobadfish]

I'm off....I'll be out tonight and may miss the show, but hopefully the endurance comp will last awhile and I can catch the end. Y'all have fun! Go JMac.

[KittyBoodles]

Ken wrote

" Their discussion makes it abundantly clear, it's not the money, it's the fun they are after. "

This and the " Summer Camp " mentality that several HG's have had this season and the last few seasons, makes me nuts.

To me, that's a huge casting fail, and something needs to change with that whole process. BB gets thousands of applications from fans who want to play, and play to win, and not just hang out all summer and be friends, not really caring about playing for the money, wanting to be on the show for the exposure and whatever ' red carpet and limo ' (and wanting to be on other shows) stuff - is it me? Am I just not seeing it in the past players that much any longer? The want to play and want to win mentality, I mean.

Weird. It seems the days of strong players may be gone if they don't change their casting formula and vetting of players, and BB seriously needs to change up their games so the hamsters can't just sit back and know what's coming and how to beat the repeated games.

Good grief, even season 12 when BB made them get up and dance at any given time was fun to watch for.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still a BB fan, I just would like to see something new, new comps, etc.

I've been trying to think of who would be worthy of a new All Stars game - starting with the season just after the last All Stars... Who would you pick out of the whole pool?

Hope everyone has a great day!

[sofieckcs]

At least we're not seeing the HG's that come on to have sex on the feeds and run around naked. I spent a lot of time walking away from the feeds for a few minutes. The last few seasons have been much better about that. I guess I'd rather have the summer camp mentality with bowling games and BB court.

[~smee~]

It's not just you, KittyBoo. I think the repeat comps have been terrible for the game. Surely someone can come up with something new.
I don't know when the last season before All Stars was -- but I would love to see Kevin, again, or maybe Renny. I forget most everyone else's name.

[KittyBoodles]

Smee! Just not one of the 8 bazillion Andy's, right??!!


Sofieckcs, well, true, you got me there!

[BBhead]

Hoping for a Jmac HOH win (and I hope BB fumigates the room for him), with Vanessa and Liz on the block. One of them needs to go this week; don't care which one. I SO do not want Jackie back in the game (she was always and still is irrelevant in this game, in my eyes). Shelli would have the most impact. Even now, the house guests can't go a day without saying Shelli/Clay. Meg and James.....holy crow, sleep much????? Meg seems to have become a bad influence on James. BB should tell Austin to shower, or at least wash his hands. Maybe even come over the speaker: Austin, STOP THAT! For all his talk about Irish Spring, it would be refreshing to see him actually use it. With the number of people still left in the house, this was the most boring week of feeds I can remember in years. It doesn't help that I really only like Jmac at this point. The rest can go.

[~smee~]

I actually liked Jackie from TAR days, but I would rather see Shelli come back, too, BBhead. And I am in total agreement about Austin and his hygiene issues. Can't they give penalty noms/votes for NOT washing hands or showering????

[beckyd30]

Burn the mattress

[BettyBoo]

Wish we had a cam in the Jury House to hear what Shelli and Jackie are sharing, despite the handlers. I'm hoping for a feisty Jackie to return and kick the campers into fight mode. Enough rope-a-dope, let's score some punches.

We all think tonight will be endurance, but Steve (I think) thought it might be a building comp. That could benefit J-Mac over James (despite his skills with foil-grin). I do not want to see a Vanessa, Austin or Julia HOH win, since I wanna see one of them or especially Liz gone.

Also wish we could give them each a dose of pentothal since they make, to us, illogical moves. KeninVA you strap them down and I'll jab the needle in and we'll do a Vanessa-style interrogation with lots of 'splain, Lucy!

Last year I was yelling at the HGs for Derrick blindness. But, the fact that he didn't even trust Cody w/the info that he's a cop, shows the tight game he played. There's no master this year. Vanessa is vulnerable since she's played too hard and didn't understand that this year was about play and fun and yes I wonder how Derrick would have fared in this different climate? Dan would have done great w/his sense of humor.

Austin has thrived, despite losing his 1st buddy Jace, moving on to Liz and now James. He was threatened during Vanessa' s last reign, but did his mea culpa on his knees and not only survived, but was strengthened by the addition of Julia. Of course, it can all come to a crashing end tonight w/the right HOH or returning HG next week. That's the magic if the season, we just can't figure it out since the unconventional is their SOP.

Like Ziggie once said: Soon as I get used to change, it all changes.

[Ellee1]

What do you all think of Liz telling Julia that she would take Austin to the final 2 and not Julia? Real or bs?

[emptysuit]

I disagree with those who think Liz will take Austin. When push comes to shove and the money is actually on the line, I believe she will take her sister over Austin, despite what she said to Julia yesterday. Those blood ties are hard to break and especially with twins. Liz will realize the reaction she would get from her family as well if she chose new boyfriend Austin over her sister. If she is serious about continuing the relationship with Austin after BB, she knows that choosing Julia over Austin would not elicit a huge reaction from Austin. He would expect it. Austin has it bad for Liz and has used the word “love”. I don't think the relationship has developed enough for Liz to express those same feelings yet. She will have a very strong bond with her sister for as long as they live........not necessarily so with Austin who she has only known for a couple of months or so. My money is on Liz and Julia preferring each other over anyone else. She will choose family over a showmance, even if the showmance turns into something much more serious further down the road.

[cutencuddly]

Listening to Liz a minute later, I was pretty sure that Liz was kidding about taking Austin. Just a straight-faced twin joke.

[KeninVA]

Plus, since they will split the money, why give up 50K. If both get into the f2 chairs, other than bragging rights (which for Liz, will be wiped out by the expected Perez Hilton and TMZ buzz), winning from a money standpoint doesn't actually mean much.

[OutOfTheDarkness]

Please ole OTEV, Please please please... Let AG see that something like an endurance buy pack where if the three evicted HG last longer than the first three current HG who drop; those HGs get automatically evicted and replaced in the house with the three evicted HGs. Then make the first three to drop be Austin, Julia and Vanessa!! And finally let one of the returning HG win HOH!! We the fans deserve to see a REAL season of BB!! Not this Summer Camp version. Getting those three out and bringing the other three back will truly change this game/season up and make things watchable. Letting one house guest back in has proven to not shake anything really up. Learn from your mistakes AG!

Oh and can you get King Kong to stop fondling Fay Rae. I'm not wanting to see FX's Freak Show!

Thanks a bunch OTEV!!

[beckyd30]

I would say have Austin, Vanessa and Liz drop, just cause Liz is meaner, but Julia works as long as Liz is out at F3.

[Shan]

Goooooood Morning BBU'rs!!! and Happy Eviction Day!!

I'm excited for tonight's show/events because I'm so over the Austwins HOH reign. SO. OVER. IT.

Of course, for my own personal 'game' (i.e. Strictly mindless entertainment with some drama thrown in there in the form of 'reality' TV) I have my preferences as to who goes tonight (at least that looks good for me..unless these whackadoodles wake up today and totally flip the script lol) and who wins HOH ..can't wait for it to all play out!

I totally "get it" for those of y'all who are frustrated with the "summer camp" mentality but for me, I only get bothered by that if one (or more) of my faves (which this year really hasn't been many, if any) gets caught up in that and it starts to threaten their game. Otherwise, if it doesn't seem to leading to their immediate boot, I don't care if they play camp kid I think that's because, while I can certainly appreciate and be impressed by super strategist game play, I just not that bothered if it's not a part of a player or their game. In the end, if one makes it to the end and especially if they win...no matter how that happened it *was* their 'strategy' (even if they didn't realize/intend it to be lol) that got them there. Even if their form of play (or 'strategy') was one that people didn't like, appreciate, agree with, or even view as a strategy at all.

At any rate, I'm still on JMac-Island with an occasional hop over to visit James Island, Meg Island and even once in a while Vanessa Island.

As of right now, my personal ideal F4 is JMac, James, Meg and Vanessa with a F2 of JMac and James. (Yeah I know..I know..lol) outta those I'd probably be ok with any of them F2 WITH JMac

Have a great day all! I'll be peeking in on and off all day and then jump in chat for the show! Weeee!

[KittyBoodles]

Very true, on all points!

I guess it's just that time during the season for me I want something different to happen. Something to shake them up and get them out of bed!

[Shan]

I totally get that KittyBoodles! I mean..don't get me wrong, even if I don't care if they strategize or whatever...I DO still like to see them move from the bed and DO something... ANYthing so I'm with ya on that for sure! I like BBUK in that way as they don't let them lay in bed all the time ..they have something for them to be doing every day. It's "fun" and I like it Of course, their way of 'eviction' is different (like it used to be here) as well and I kinda like their way on that too.

[Shan]

Me again..
(I knooooowwwuuuhhh..I just won't go awaaaaayyyyyuuuuhhhh!)

Just a quick reminder for the Fantasy Game players...gotta get those answers in before 9:00 (EST) tonight y'all!

So you have about 10 hours left peeps..go throw your darts --->>> HERE